Please leave your message at the bottom of the page. Thanks for dropping by! Jason Bessey - Jaywin (talk)

including the navigation template

Its useful if you are setting a page up for the first time to include the navigation template for that section. The evolutionary psychology section uses the BioPsy template, although there is no reason why you couldnt do a similar evolutionary one.

Are you in the position to set up the structure of the evolution section at

Biological psychology: Evolutionary psychologyso that it your new articles are logically divided up. I use the metaphor of nested book chapters, one chapter in one book leading to another book of chaptersLifeartist 22:36, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

Good work on the Biological psychology: Evolutionary psychologypage.

Ive gathered together some more links there for you to organise. I see from MostlyZens page you've been personally approaching people for material, thats a neat strategy, hopefully some of the big names might be enticed to join us, at least we get great contentLifeartist 05:37, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

another good thing you are doing which I like is looking for the main researchers {and by implication the main research groups} around the world working on an area. I think this is a good thing to make explicit for all the main areas, as it makes the raft of papers that come out more intelligible.
Have you decided on becoming an administrator yet?Lifeartist 21:15, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

Genes and Environment

Hi Jay,

I like your answer in the debate. I didn't realise there were so many areas of Evolutionary psychology. I am quite interested in evolution, but in the past I've fallen into the trap of attributing too much to genetics and not enough to how we adapt our behaviour to our environment. You are right of course that behaviour is the result of the interaction of the two. The ToK stuff makes this quite clear. I'll post a proper response on the debate page. Mostly Zen 21:16, 22 June 2006 (UTC)


Congratulations - you are now an administrator

I've signed you up for the priveleges!!! I too have some thoughts to put up on the debate, but Ive been held up this evening - I found a source of internet addresses for thousands of psychology journals and have been trying to format them for our purposes. It just shows me that there is a tremendous information management problem in the area which only something like the wiki can address.Lifeartist 21:41, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

Hey, good to learn you've become an Admin too. If you are online now, could you have a look at the Psychology_Wiki_For_Beginners page? I'm trying to get this page sorted out so we can invite more contributors. Tell me what you think, and leave lists of ideas for improvement on the page if you want, so we can flesh them out. Mostly Zen 22:20, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

Vandalism?

Might have just had our first vandalism. Someone edited loads of Info off of the main page. Might have been an accident, but it was a single edit from a random IP address, which seemed odd. I changed it back again. I don't really want to protect pages just yet, as its not fair on other contributors. Apparently the best thing to do with vandals is ignore them, block their IP and revert the page back to normal. If we get lots of vandalism on a page then we can protect the page, but not sure its a good idea. Mostly Zen 22:23, 22 June 2006 (UTC)

Discussion

I was thinking we could do with a general discussion forum, rather than using each others Talk pages all the time.

Why Don't we use the Community Portal talk page for general stuff, and sort out our various conversations under the correct topics? I'm getting lost with all these messages...

We could also have an Admin discussion forum somewhere for admin related stuff? As long as we check these 2 pages regularly things will be fine. Urgent messages still on userpages is fine. It also makes the wiki look more 'Alive' to other contributors if they can read what we're up to. See you on the Community Portal Talk page. Mostly Zen 22:23, 22 June 2006 (UTC)


New textbook

There's a new textbook for Evolutionary Psychology just been published in the States. ISBN 0471264032 . If you follow it to the Amazon.com site you can go to the chapter headings. It might give you some more ideas for structuring the headings and drawing together the various articles you've been collecting.Lifeartist 14:26, 25 June 2006 (UTC) Ah good, glad you knew of it. Its clearly a developing area which Buss seems to have covered pretty extensively!. I had actually got to it after following the links you gave me. Thanks for those, one of the joys of working on the wiki is that it takes me into new areas, I always find it interesting how other people are seeing things.Lifeartist 22:36, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Depression paper

Interesting stuff Jaywin. I'm going to work hard on the depression page this week, to try and get it up to scratch. If you and I build on the work Lifeartist has done then it will work well.

Once the general article is in place I'm going to ask Wikipedians who are in the category User:Depressed if they would like to contribute an anonymous exerience of depression. I've suffered quite badly from it myself in the past and it still gets me (Daaark moods) every so often, so I'll make it a sensitive and friendly invite. After that is underway I think we should go on a serious recruitment drive. Lets discuss this on the Community Portal Talk. Mostly Zen 23:19, 25 June 2006 (UTC)

Psi Chi Link

Excellent stuff, I got us listed on www.psychology.org recently. I thought that Psi Chi was some kind of Fraternity before I followed the link (we don't have fraternities in the UK, which is a shame). Am doing lots on Depression today, please pop by and let me know what you think/want to contribute. Best to discuss it on the depression discussion page. I'm going to add that article to my watchlist. Mostly Zen 14:01, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Brilliant All the links we can trade the better, as it increases the google rank and sends traffic to the site. See google analytics for current picture. I had never heard of Psi Chi but have put their article up now as a return for their favour. Lifeartist


New admin forum

I've been experimenting setting up forums and have one going at Forum:Admin_discussion_forum which we can use for admin stuff.Lifeartist 20:27, 3 July 2006 (UTC)

10th July Update

Hey Jaywin,

Here is the update I am sending to all users today. Today I have contacted Jim Wales to tell him about our project. I have also contacted Angela, Sannse and Gil, who work for Wikia. Have a look here and see what you think of the promotion. Hope you are doing good :)

Just to let you know that the Psychology Wiki is continuing to grow. Check out our:

Hope you can help us building the community. Otherwise, please let other people know about us as much as you can, or log in and vote for us to be a featured Wikia here: Vote

Cheers

Mostly Zen 22:32, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Where abouts are you based Jaywin?

Lifeartist is going to Wikimania to meet Gil (the CEO of Wikia) and Jim Wales (the Founder of wikipedia) its in Harvard law school apparently. I cant afford to fly out there from England, but aren't you based in the US somewhere? I as pretty sure you were.

If you can make that weekend it would be a good idea, I think its only $70, but accomodation is a bit more. It would be good for you to be able to meet Lifeartist, as he only lives in the next town from me (coincidentally) so we get to talk on the phone really cheaply and I've met him in person once.

Hope things are going well with you anyway Mostly Zen 01:08, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

Thats OK. I am too broke to go as well, but I thought we should tell you because it would be closer for you. Basically Gil and Jim think the Psychology Wiki is a damn good idea and are going to start marketing us heavily after Wikimania, ie after august 6th. Have a look on Lifeartists talk page for more info, and see our discussion on Gils page too. The Wikimania link above should explain what the meeting is about.
Sorry to hear you are a bit poor at the moment, I'm in the same position, having finished my 2nd year of my degree, and unable to get any temporary work over the summer, as there are about 10,000 students in this city trying to do the same thing! Speak to you later Mostly Zen 09:54, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

Google analytics

Hi Jaywin. Just to remind you that the google analytics page is starting to produce some interesting data. You can get to the page following these instructions Google Analytics report and then choosing to view the report. The map with where our visitors come from is really pleasingLifeartist 22:43, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

Added some templates

Just to keep you up to date with what I've been doing.

  • I've redesigned the Comm Portal and To Do completely, they are a lot better now and should help the users/contributors. Comm portal is going to the the best page for using/navigating the whole site, To Do is going to be the best page to editing the whole site.
  • Lifeartist has been working hard on Clinical Depression and various copying of content and many other things.
  • Ive made 3 new templates, Browsebar, Admins and Active talk. Ive put these on your userpage. Move them whereever you want.
  • We've got a complete list of Journals, and good lists of blogs and forums to start advertising the project on. Have a look at the Attracting New Contributors part of the community portal (and its main article) on what we are going to do.
  • After Wikimania, Gil and Jim Wales will hopefully give us some serious marketing muscle.

Hope you're doing OK Mostly Zen 16:43, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

I've just made myself a funky new signiature too: Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) See the beginners guide to editing to see how I did it, or I can make one for you :)


New Way of Indexing

Just a thought but... people have asked me why we are trying to build a chapter heading type index (see Main_Page) instead of just using Wiki Categories. I thought about it and they are right. We shouldn't try to make this project like it is a book, we should use the technology available and let it do the work for us.

What I wanted to ask you, seeing as how you have done more category work than me or Lifeartist is, could you come up with some ideas for a better way to index the whole site? I think we'd still want to index in a similar way, except using Wiki categories to build the index for us naturally. Let me know what Ideas you have.

Secondly, we are going to start emailing people soon, because Wikia might start marketing us in August, so if we start working on an invite (i'll link you when I start it) we can send it out to all the blogs/forums/websites etc...

I have just finished our tutorial (see Help) and am cleaning up the help pages. Also, check out the General Discussion Forum and the list of things to do (linked from Tasks to Do Portal). Let me know what you think of all this stuff and change anything that looks wrong...

Hope everything is going well over in your side of the world :)

Take it easy man

Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 23:23, 23 July 2006 (UTC)

Yes, you are right, its very tricky, especially due to the fragmented nature of Psychology. The problem is, that even if we DON'T use the Wiki categories, we will have to build the type of Index that Lifeartist imagined, with chapter headings etc... which will be just as difficult, and more work.
We could rely on the fact that this is not like a book, and has a good search function. If we were going to Index depression for example, we could categorize it under... Clinical, mental health and maybe some other categories. If we were going to index the MBTI test, we could categorize it under Tests, and Personality.
We could let people search using Just the search function, but point out how the categories work in a tutorial (or help) which I am doing? Then if you found say, the Hamilton Depression rating scale, you could go to the Category and find out what other rating scales we have and what other Depression articles we have.
Those were my ideas, indexing by category subjects, rather than trying to break down the whol subject into discrete boxes. That would just fragment it more. The categories can have considerable overlap, which might help to integrate the field... hmmm... I feel a diagram coming on... Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 10:03, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

Diagrams

Have a look at this Diagram:

The Psychology Wiki can account for the overlap between different fields of knowledge in a way that is impossible in a standard text book model of learning.

Many different fields in Psychology overlap considerably in their content. In trying to break these areas of content down into discrete fields, psychology has become fragmented.

  • The nature of a textbook structure is such that this is necessary to present the information clearly.
  • The nature of an interlinked online resource is such that the overlap can be accounted for in multiple categories. * Articles which belong in two or more categories can be archived as such, and hence found by researchers in discrete specialisms.

I'm working on another too... Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 15:03, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

Heres the diagram idea, but for Psychology as a whole. Note how its similar to the tree of knowledge, only not hierarchical. Henriques is correct though, I just think that his diagram does not make it clear though how things like the social environment impact on the physical one (all the building, farming and pollution causing extinction & climate change for example). I'm sure he has taken that into account, perhaps it is a mistake to interpret the cones diagram in that manner.

Anyway, here is the other diagram (bottom left)

All the fields of Psychology overlap considerably. They are in fact all part of the study of human mind & behaviour.

  • Learning psychology, it was necessary to split the discipline into discrete areas, in order to analyse it properly, and to reduce the effect of confounding external influences.
  • However, in doing so, we have lost sight of the fact that it is in fact one unified field, the study of human mind and behaviour.
  • Categorisation in a new format, the Psychology Wiki, should allow us to account for the overlap between presently seperate fields and hence integrate the knowledge.
  • Don't take this diagram too literally, its just to illustrate the point. In reality these fields are of varying sizes and overlap in multiple dimensions, which are impossible to diagramize. The Psychology Wiki's categories should allow us to capture all the information in its proper fields though.

Right! enough of me practicing articles on your user talk, let me know what you think. This could be a major 'selling point' of the Psychology Wiki idea :)

Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 15:45, 24 July 2006 (UTC)

  • See also this discussion in the general forum. We had a new contributor arrive who is keen to make some structure changes. Sorry, its sometimes hard to in touch with you because of the time difference. Hope things are good in the US :) Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 21:45, 25 July 2006 (UTC)

Fixing the Structure

Wow, theres a lot of debate ongoing about this one on the main discussion forum, good to see its being used and useful. Im glad the user based structure (Comm Portal, Forum, Tasks to Do & Help & Talk Pages) are working at least.

Yes, you are completely right about epistemological differences. Even with the Tree of Knowledge, it is one thing to observe biological psychological behaviour, and a totally different thing to be personally experiencing it. I think this is more due to a basic split in our perception of reality. I experience my personal reality, and I experience Jason as some clever American guy I talk to online. You experience yourself as 'I' and experience Tom as a crazy english dude who sends you rambling emails.

I don't think the split of inner and outer worlds of experience can ever be unified. Its just a basic part of reality. Good Psychology should never be radical behaviourism or radical introspectionism though (i tend to the latter to be honest). We dont need to worry about that split, thats just a given, we just need to make sure that neither side of the split of behaviourism or internalism think that THEY have the 'true' psychology.

We just have to recognise that Behaviourism is the other side of the coin from Personal Experience. Eating lots of foods containing Tryptophan will boost your serotonin levels, and that feels like happiness. I always found that the best way to truly realise that biology/chemistry IS consciousness was to take a psychedelic, e.g. Psilocybin paper. Having a strong background in chemistry and physics, my own personal 'spiritual' experiences have been along the lines of realising and accepting that I am physics, chemistry, biology and culture. It can give you a sense of unity like that.

This is probably why I loved the tree of knowledge that you showed me so much. It provided a structure for thoughts and models of reality I had been thinking of for quite a while. I've added the ToK to my Myspace I love the idea so much. I really must finish reading Henriques paper in full...

Don't worry about being an Anal INTP. At least you are Intuitive. If everyone was an ENFJ like me, nothing would ever get done as we sat around and philophised. It takes all sorts to build a community.

Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 17:55, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

Greetings

Hello Jaywin, Just wanted to say thanks for your warm welcome. Look forward to working with you. Sonrisasgrandes 16:05, 26 July 2006 (UTC) :)

Another one for your collection

Just came across him by accident but thought you would be interestd! Geoffrey Miller (evolutionary psychologist)62.30.116.41 21:27, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

Categories

Hi Jaywin,

I hope things are going well with you. Here's a start on our new Category system, which is going to be a long (and slow) process for us to sort out. Have a look at these 2 forums:

One we have sorted out how to use the categories properly, we can copy the forum discussions to their own pages on the Psychology Wiki, a page for the Category Tree and a page on How to use Categories.

At the moment, its such a big task, that it deserves its own forum to discuss it. You are actually much better at this stuff than me (anal INTP again I think!) so please let me know what you think, and feel free to take over this aspect if you want, I'm much happier attracting new contributors to be honest (being an extrovert I guess) Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 21:21, 30 July 2006 (UTC)

PS Lifeartist and I have just decided to start using Real names for the project. You can change your signiature to add your real name here: Psychology_Wiki_For_Beginners#Fancy_signatures if you like :) Tom Michael - Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk)


IRC channel:

Hey Jason,

Want to say hello in IRC? irc://irc.freenode.net/wiki-psy

Tom Michael - Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 14:08, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

Hmmm I don't know why its broken. IRC stands for internet relay chat. Its a live chatroom, so we can discuss the project basically. Once I've worked out what's wrong with it, I can really get it working for us. Good stuff on those categories, we're starting to get there now.

Also, I've been emailing the bloglist and have contacted about 50 wikipedians who are psychology academics, professionals or students. Things are looking good :)

Tom Michael - Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 14:22, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

I've added some links about how to use IRC to the bottom left of the help panel in the Community portal. Let me know if that helps. Apparently the link I gave you only works for the Opera browse (a funny one which I have). Zen.

Chat?

Hello Jason, MostlyZen and I were going to try and get together on MSN some time tonight to chat. He's in the UK, however so the time difference doesn't really permit this to happen. So, he recommended I talked to you to see if you'd be online at all tonight. My contact info's on my user page. Hope you're having an excellent day. Andrew Schramm (talk) 20:23, 31 July 2006 (UTC) :)


Wow! Good work Jason

Good stuff getting rid of all those born-died categories, I think I managed about 20 of them, but got so bored that I gave up. I've looked through the categories and we've reduced them to about 2,800 now, which is approx 250 less categories than the first time I checked. I've had a few more thoughts about the categories, but lets talk about this in the How to use categories general forum.

As and when we managed to sort out which subcategories belong in each group, we can update the category tree in the general forum too.

Oh yes, If you get MSN messenger, you can talk to myself, lifeartist and Andrew (Sonrisasgrandes). Especially andrew, as hes in the same time zone as you, whereas me and Lifeartist live within 15 miles of each other, which is a lucky coincidence, as we'd not met before we started this.

Tom Michael - Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 22:29, 31 July 2006 (UTC)

I've just got Yahoo so I can talk to you. I'm assuming its nysa71(AT)yahoo(DOT)com right? Tom Michael - Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 23:39, 31 July 2006 (UTC)
My yahoo address is mostly_zen(AT)yahoo.co.uk

History Link

Yes I really like that history idea, we can eventually get a bot to add in all those appropriate dates. It looks like a really good idea, just the right way to format the dates. Don't worry about taking the idea from the Star wars wiki, its a well put together community full of good ideas. I adapted our beginners guide from the Muppet Wiki (believe it or not!)

Is there any way you can use MSN, or at least come online on your Yahoo? I'm getting messages on my userpage from you, Andy, Lifeartist and some other people faster than I can type replies!

We really need to get one messaging system working for all of our users, maybe I can work out how to make IRC easy for people to use, otherwise it might have to be MSN, as its far more commonly used in the UK (pretty much everyone in fact) and myself and lifeartist are already on it. Is there any way you can try to install it again? I'm happy talking to you on Yahoo, but Lifeartist is on MSN too, and it'd be better to have one system being used from the start. At least this way you'd have your Psy Wiki contacts seperate from your Yahoo friends! :)

Tom Michael Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 17:04, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

Hi Jason,
I'll start at 1950 and work my way towards 2006 applying your dates page. Race you? Tom Michael Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 19:30, 1 August 2006 (UTC)
PS: You do know you can use Template:Pagename dont you?
Er... we missed out a dash - between the 3rd and 4th to last dates! I thought it was just my typo! sorry!
OK, but I ended up putting that stub back in again! Im thinking that adding the templates {{Browsebar}} and {{Psych-stub}} might be a good idea too. Tom Michael Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 20:39, 1 August 2006 (UTC)
Actually I take that back, the history section looks better without those included
Hi Jason,

Just to add my congratulations on your latest scheme. It looks as if it is going to work really well. I for one appreciate the effort you are puting in here. Things like the Timeline idea will make this such a useful resource in the years to come. Ive put some links to it all on History of Psychology, capital P which is where the history section is housed.Dr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 21:17, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

Arg! you won then... I was doing really well, but then Bri bri came onto MSN, and me, her and Joe started talking. Try to download MSN messenger again if you can, because theres 4 of us that have it now :) Tom Michael Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 21:36, 1 August 2006 (UTC)

Zen gone to get some work

Hi Jason,

Lack of money has meant that I am going to stay at my sisters house, where I can get some work as a Labourer, helping my brother in law who is a builder. At my sisters house they have NO internet Eeeeek! Anyway, this means that I won't be here to look after things, and with Lifeartist away at Wikimania it will be pretty quiet. Do you think you can look after things and newcomers etc... until I get back? I might be a week or two! Lifeartist is due back from Wikimania in about 4 days anyway.

Hope things are good with you..

Tom Michael Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 11:41, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

Just to say I am back in circulation

Hi Jason. Just to let you know that I am back after a brief holiday.

Nice work on the timeline and noting the start of our enterprise.!

I have just looked at the google analytics data and we have doubled our visitors to over 2000 per week in the last fortnight, so getting our name out on the blogs has really worked.Dr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 00:52, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

The economics question

I understood what you think. All articles should be in group 1 unless they are entitled the same as a section. eg because there is a clinical psychology section the clinical psychology page needs to be called Introduction to cliinical psychology. So if someone types in clinical psychology they get taken to the section and the can look at the basic article if they want to.

With economics we dont have a section yet, although you might argue we should have, either under Ind&Org psychology or encompassing consumer psychology which is in "other fields". If we have the section its style 2 if not keep it as background material and style 1. if in doubt style 1 and it can be changed to style 2 later. We need to check with Tom as I think he was starting to use style three as he tidied up the main category pages. Dr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 14:29, 14 August 2006 (UTC)


Thanks for sorting out these creases!

My understanding is that it should be biological psychology, I think I got into biopsychology, just to get it into the navigation template. It looks like Tom carried that on but the original article on WP was "biological psychology" - so probably best to stick with that.Hope that helpsDr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 19:23, 14 August 2006 (UTC)

Zen is back

Hi Jason,

No more building work for the time being, so I am back here to build some more of the Wiki instead. It all looks good, my marketing work has doubled our weekly visitors to 2000+ :)

I was thinking we should make the Tree of Knowledge System our next featured article, as Clinical depression is far too large a topic for 3 of us to do justice to. The ToK is a homegrown project too, started and written entirely on this Wiki.

Im recruiting physicist and biologist friends of mine to contribute to their specialist sections. Once its done to a good standard, we can present it as the next featured article and you can email Dr Henriques again.

Hope things are good in the US

Tom Michael Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 14:10, 15 August 2006 (UTC)

Wow!

Jaywin, That's so awesome. Thanks for letting me know, I'm looking forward to seeing where that article goes. I feel like I should delete my rambling comments on its talk page. :/ Hope you're having a good day. Andrew Schramm (talk) 17:07, 17 August 2006 (UTC)

  • Jaywin, when I was doing some work on the main page under the "How do I contribute to the psy wiki" section I think I accidentally deleted something. Now the color from that template is going all the way down to the bottom of the page. I'm not sure how to fix this. Thanks for your help, sorry! Andy Schramm Sonrisasgrandes(talk) 20:11, 17 August 2006 (UTC)
Hi Jason.The search facility doesnt work for me either, They updated the database this morning and they have probably need to restore it completely. A good place to raise this is on the wikia IRC, thats where the staff hang out and they can normally answer the questions if none of us are around. Follow wiki Home link on the left panel and then go to their community portal.Hope this helpsDr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 22:38, 17 August 2006 (UTC)

Forum troubles

Yes I was trying out the forum and realised you had the same problem as me. In the end Soparla fixed it for me but I dont know how. They said they would improve the instructions on the Wikia help pages, but I am not sure if they did. If you go on the forum there you may find the links that we discussed at the time. Sorry I can be of more helpDr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 20:51, 18 August 2006 (UTC)

The problem with ToK was the missing header template: Template:Forumheader/ToK discussion forum. Because the forums use <inputbox> they have to work within the limitations of that system (more inputbox info). The preload parameter in the inputbox allows a template to be inserted into the blank page you are creating for a new forum topic, but the template has to be created separately for each new forum. --Splarka (talk) 02:13, 19 August 2006 (UTC)
Congratulations Jason, on your persistence. Its nice to know that the help is out there when we reach the limits of our knowledgeDr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 14:58, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

Thanks

Jaywin, just wanted to say thanks for sending me that link. I think it's great that you've established this connection... this article is going to be so great. Andy Schramm Sonrisasgrandes(talk) 05:25, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

ToK article by Gregg Henriques

Wow Jason this is looking good. I think that there are several things we can do with this:

  1. Keep the main article on ToK as an article that anyone can edit, rather than replacing it with Henriques article.
  2. Link from ToK to the expert written article ToK by Gregg Henriques.
  3. Protect the article by Henriques, and give it a coloured background to distinguish it from normal articles that anyone can edit.
  4. Make this another unique point of the Psychology Wiki. If we attract guest contributors (experts) to write articles for us one-by-one in the same way that Henriques has, and have these article Protected, and written in Parallel to the main articles, it would be really good.

Of course, the expert can come and update their articles at any time, possibly in light of information brought up in the general user written article (written by general psychologists who don't specialise in their area necessarily).

What do you think of this idea? I think its a good way that we can write the wiki. Its slow, but it means that we can all contribute together, slowly build up quality general articles, with quality expert articles in parallel, to supplement the placeholder articles we already have copied over from WP.

Hope things are going well with you, I will help lots on the ToK stuff :)

Tom Michael Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 12:44, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

Hi Jason,
Theres a couple of reasons why I thought seperate 'written by the author/expert' articles would be a good idea.
1) Because anyone can edit the article, people would come back (eventually) and change what Herniques had written. This irritates most experts immensley (more so on WP than it would do on the Psy Wiki though I'd imagine) as most experts are better qualified to write the article than most other contributors (even on this wiki). This is one of the chief complaints about WP by experts who have taken time to contribute there.
2) Having expert written articles (which was effectively your idea originally, involving Henriques) will dramatically raise our credibility amongst the academic psychology community.
3) However, if we replaced the community written articles with expert written ones, it wouldnt really be following the spirit of wiki writing, which was why I thought that expert articles in parallel to community articles would be the best way forwards. This way we get the advantages of both approaches, whilst minimizing the disadvantages.
4) The expert articles would inform the general reader and hence raise the quality of the community articles. Likewise, the community articles may actually contain information which the expert had not considered or encountered. There may be critiques/papers of ToK related theory that Henriques has not encountered for example, or an interpretation of his theory by another reader might give him an idea that he may not have already had. All of our research and ideas come from reading other peoples ideas.
5) Attracting expert guest writers will also attract more expert guest writers (and more contributors) hence raising our readership, contributors and credibility again.

I think your template idea is good, we can have a coloured background as part of the template. I'll try to do this tonight on your sandbox article, and a template linking the article on ToK system article too.

Speak to you later Tom Michael Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 21:20, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

PS: I've done the templates now, and added them to Tree_of_Knowledge_System and User:Jaywin/ToK_sandbox. At the moment they are ugly and the colours and formatting need changing, but they should give you the idea. There are some better colours here: HTML colours Find one that you think is good for the expert article, so long as its different from the colours we already use. Why we English have the letter u in colour is beyond me :) Tom Michael Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 22:40, 20 August 2006 (UTC)

For a name for expert written articles how about ARTICLE NAME/Expert article by Dr Seuss blah de blah
For example: Tree_of_Knowledge_System/Expert_article_by_Gregg_Henriques which currently redirects to your sandbox, could be the home for that article. Have a look at those templates and see how I have written them, so you can see how the linking and categorising works. I agree, a lighter blue would be better, I'll try a sapphire type colour instead of the Steel Blue. Tom Michael Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 21:59, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

Social processes

I think its the advantage of the category system that we can link a category to a number of areas, so its a good idea to do what you've done.As long as people can find the material they need, thats the main thing. The way we have changed things around shows me the old psychInfo headiings are probably out of date. In a way what we are doing is coming up with a new way of categorising our disciplineDr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 06:50, 23 August 2006 (UTC)

Forum

Hi Jason, Ive changed that link for you, let me know if you think its better. You can edit those sidebars easily at: MediaWiki:Sidebar but it think it should be an admin kept secret for the time being!

Also, check out Universities and follow the Newman College links there, so you can see an example of what I'm doing. Do you think you could do something similar for your University? I was thinking Andy could too...

Tom Michael Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 13:04, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

Hi Jason,
Yes, lets protect that page, although not many people will find it its an obvious vandalism target and should be for admins only. I'm going to add some more links, external resource things, once I can get them sorted. Also, yes, change the links as suggested on Joes page, it looks much neater.
What do you think of the Universities idea so far?
Psychology Department homepage I'd say. I'd have done that for my Uni, but Newman is rather small and our Psy Dept webpage is only accessible through our intranet, so I've linked to that elsewhere. Newman students will know how to find the relevant stuff. Which Uni are you at again?

You're right about this, formatting in the Standard Formatting Guide should be:

Hey Jason, before you get too stuck in, I'd categorise the Universities directly into their country group in the Category:Universities, ie miss out the Universities by country category, as its redundant. What would we put in universities that we wouldnt have listed by country?
What I mean is:

Category:Universities

Category:American universities
Category:British Universities
Newman College article etc...

That way it stays nice and simple. Theres room in the Category:Universities for everything I think.

  • See Also: (internal wiki links)
  • External links: (other web site info on that topic)
  • References & Bibliography: (As per the better layout discussed on Joes page)

I think you are right about the State categories. I'd keep it simple though and just call it Universities, but I think I've made it clear (you can emphasise this if you like) that its Universities, colleges and other institutions that are Psychology degree providers. Category:Universities should be fine so long as we make that clear.

Right im going to BED, its like 2am here and ive drunk too much wine to be writing stuff...

I have put up a list of American states on the American universities page if thats helpfulDr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 01:30, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

University directory style

Hi Jason,

I set it up as University/Newman because I wanted to leave space for an article for Newman College as an institution. If you look at things such as University/Newman/Year 1/PY401 etc... then the convention makes more sense.

I cant imagine that we will ever actually write an article about Newman the institution, as its a small place which is not especially important for Psychology research. However, if we were to talk about Birmingham university or MIT or Harvard or Cambridge we clearly need a seperate article to talk about these places in terms of their importance to psychology (both historically and contemporary research wise) as well as University/Birmingham etc.. for the course content.

We also need to be careful with naming, as you have a Birmingham in Alabama right? and isnt harvard in cambridge in America? Whereas our cambridge is our second oldest university in this country.

Hope that makes sense

See Forum:University links for discussionn on this.

Tom Michael Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 14:57, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

IRC channel

Hi Jason. Tom had explored setting this up but we had a bit of trouble getting it to work and it was shelved. I think he was hoping to get it up and running later when ther were more of us working round the clockDr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 23:39, 27 August 2006 (UTC)

Journals

No problem man. I ran outta steam for a while, its good to have something simple to do to get back into things. Tom Michael Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 16:07, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

Great job guys. If you fancy something else simple it would be good to check the website details for each journal and fill in any easily obtained info. Then I can email the editors. It just shows what a bit of teamwork and fast computers can achieveDr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 16:25, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

Could you help me out please

Hi Jason. I've drawn up a list of categories for each country but I dont know how to get them into the a Psychology by country category. I've copied them to Temporary page for Jaywin could you sort it for me at some time please - no rush. ThanksDr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 17:18, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

Sorry Jason the wife had me go out to help here with the shopping!!!!

I had in mind Category:world psychology then within that a Category:Psychology by country then within Each country Category:X universities, Category:X psychology organizations, etc. Is what you are doing now in line with that. if it is I will join you.Dr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 19:01, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

I must be really thick as I cant work out how to use these categories!!!

Im working in "Psychology in Austria" and want to include "Austrian psychologists" and "Austrian university" categories so the contents show up in subcategories of psychology in Austria. How does it work?Answer me here for convenience. ThanksDr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 19:13, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

I can see you are making progress on Austria but I cant see how you access the page. When I go to edit the other categories arent there.I want to add in
Category:Austrian economists
Category:Austrian neuroscientists
Category:Austrian philosophers
Category:Austrian psychiatrists

There must be some way to set up the order

World
with a list of all the country categories.
Click on this say Austria and goto
Psychology in Austria
Showing
Austrian universities heading
With list of all Austrian universities below
  • Vienna university
  • Graf Universityetc
Austrian psychologists heading
With list of all Austrian psychologists below
  • Wundt
  • Freud

etc etc Is this possible if so how do we set it up?20:02, 1 September 2006 (UTC) That would be logical and tidy

Try this...

Hi Joe! Yes, this is all possible to set up. Don't worry, I'll help you get how this is done. Basically, you treat a potential sub-category as if it's just another article to be categorized. Try this little exercise...

1.) Go to Category: Psychology in Germany. Notice that it has no subcategories.

2.) Now go to Category:German psychologists. Notice there is no category at the bottom of the page.

  • Click the "edit" tab.
  • Add Category: Psychology in Germany (Of course, make sure it's in between double brackets, [[ ]])
  • Save your edit.

3.) Now, you will have Category:Psychology in Germany at the bottom of the page. Click on it.

4.) Category: German psychologists is now a subcategory of Category: Psychology in Germany

As I said before, it's no different than when you categorize an article...don't let the whole "subcategory" thing throw you!

  • If you want article A to be in category B, then you just add category B to article A
  • If you want category A to be in category B, then you just add category B to category A

See if this helps, (I hope I didn't confuse you more!) Let me know if this helped or not. Have a good one! Jason Bessey - Jaywin (talk) 21:23, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

I just thought of a of another way of putting it if the above exercise doesn't help:

"You categorize a category the same way you categorize an article." Jason Bessey - Jaywin (talk) 21:36, 1 September 2006 (UTC)
Im sorry Jason I still dont get it. I am not well at the moment and so will let it go for a day or too and then come back to you with some proper questions. I just cant get proper control of it to get the layout I describe.Can you do that on Austria? Then I will try on Germany and we can talk in detail. It all seems confusingly back to front to me. To a naive newcomer the subcategory heading is very disorientating. We will need to do a bit of a manual because if Im still not comfortable with it a lot of people will struggle. Thanks for your patienceDr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 23:15, 1 September 2006 (UTC)
Hi Jason I am trying to do category scheme 1] With the world psychology coming off browse too. But cant we also have scheme 2) I thought that was the advantage of categories. So whether you were interested in a country or in universities you would be able to get to the university by either route?Dr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 14:18, 3 September 2006 (UTC)
Good. Thats right. Many thanks for your help on sorting this out.

Can we get the content of the categories to list out in the way I described above or do you always have to click on the category to get to the list. It would be really useful for smaller categories.Dr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 15:05, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

Yes like in the Psychology in Austria example above so you would have hradings for Austrian Universities then these would be listed then a heading Austrian Psychologists, so all the Austria links could be laid out on the page. Prerhaps its something to mention to the developers.Dr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 15:31, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for Inviting me

Thanks for inviting me. I've set up a user page and will try to work on materials here whenever I get a moment. regards Dr. Becker-Weidman Talk 19:09, 3 September 2006 (UTC)

Psychologists record card

Go for it Jason. Its really just an aid for structuring. people can always delete sections that dont apply. Edit it further and Ill have a look at it.Dr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 17:44, 4 September 2006 (UTC)

I've added a bit more to the record card. I think we've improved it quite a bit. Thanks too for tidying them up and organising the category.The news about more qualified people coming on board is just what we need, the challenge is to help them become active contributors.If we can accumulate 20-30 people who know what they are doing and can consolidate the structure we will have a really firm base on which to build.Dr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 22:38, 4 September 2006 (UTC)


Call for papers page

I think this will be one of the strengths of our site, providing a stimulus for people to be more active in our science. The page needs a bit more of an introduction as I was not clear quite what it was for, and perhaps could do with a clearer name. Journals currently calling for papers?. Hope this helpsDr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 08:40, 5 September 2006 (UTC)

Blocking Admins

One of the nice things about blocking admins is that they always have the ability to unblock themselves. Other than that, I can tell you that there is no actual direct connection between user accounts and user pages. It's just made to look that way.

--Kirk 19:01, 6 September 2006 (UTC)


Greggs paper

This is really good Jason. I've made a few changes and filled a few links up from WP. Definitely make it a featured article. Could you ask Gregg for a compete bibliography , preferably with links to pdfs of all his papers so we can put that up on his page. I will put a piece up in currrent events. can you check it for accuracy and put the link in when the paper is finalised.Sorry for the delay in replying on family taxi duty etc!!!19:47, 8 September 2006 (UTC)

Nice guy syndrome

Id seen it before. but the wikify template has skewed it all over. Is that what you meant.?Ill look to see if I can fix it Nadyes articles are not really academic enough and I have asked them to include mor references. I was thinking perhaps incuding them in a section like experiences- like ideas in psychology I have found useful in my life?Dr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 19:26, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

I fixed the template a bit. Then saw your comments on the talk page, which I think are fair. Perhaps Nadyes can work up the references and try to improve the article. trouble is I am a nice guy!!!Dr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 19:30, 9 September 2006 (UTC)


Uploading powerpoints

I look forward to that!Im still not quite on top of it butI did Dolph's chapters which were pdfs last week.So assuming the powerpoints work upload them using the 'upload file link' in the toolbox on the left panel.I ran into trouble naming the image etc so to keep it simple I didnt add anything. Once they are up put the file name with the extension where you want the link to be. Highlight this link and click the picture frame next to the A on the editting toolbar on the edit page. This puts the brackets and the word image onto the link. Save and you should be done. When you click on the link you are taken to a page with the icon on to run the link.I hope this is clear. I feel there should be a way to keep the word image hidden but I havent sorted it out yet. Good luck.Dr Joe Kiff - User:Lifeartist (talk) 21:31, 9 September 2006 (UTC)

Fantastic ToK article

Hi Jason,

Just wanted to say, fantastic work on the ToK expert written article. I think that trying to attract the experts is the way forward to make the psychology wiki work. Otherwise, we will be just a slightly better version of the psychology pages on Wikipedia, only with less contributors. I will promote our new featured article on the Blogs and forums and try to get people to have a look at it to see what they think. If we aimed to get one expert article written each month, that could be a good start.

We could do with approaching other psychologists who have contributed to unification of psychology articles. I will add a see also to Our Vision to the TOK article by Henriques in order that people can relate Henriques vision to the way our project is envisaged to work.

Nice one! :)

Tom Michael Mostly Zen Baby tao.jpg (talk) 23:42, 10 September 2006 (UTC)

PS I've had a break to recharge my batteries. Im back at Uni in a couple of weeks, and its my 3rd year so I might not be quite as prolific as I was, but I'll get some work done on the wiki. We still need to get more people though cos I am quite fatigued with it after all the work we've done this summer.

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