Talk:Double bind interaction

--Margaret9mary 22:03, 28 February 2009 (UTC)--Margaret9mary 22:03, 28 February 2009 (UTC)--Margaret9mary 22:03, 28 February 2009 (UTC)

Double Bind Theory
Double Bind Theory has been mostly neglected in the last 50 years. If you read Minimal Requirements for a Theory of Schizophrenia--(in Steps to an Ecology of Mind Part III Form and Pathology in Relationships)--you will see why. Bateson (and his colleagues) were talking about various issues and on different levels all at the same time.


 * 1) They were NOT saying that double binds cause an organic brain disorder, but that systematic double binds, especially in early childhood, could cause a perpetual state of confused communication, i.e. patterns of confusion (something very stressful, even traumatic) that could sound like the word salad of "schizophrenia"
 * 2) At the same time they were using the paradigm of cybernetics/complex systems theory, which Bateson helped develop in the 1940s and which Lawrence Bale finally described properly only in 1995, contrasting it with the paradigm of classical science (see Bale's Gregory Bateson, Cybernetics and the Social/Behavioral Sciences.

When DBT is approached from the paradigm of classical science it doesn't compute. But note that as early as 1959 Bateson said "the proposed classification of learning and/or context is an ordering of what to the Newtonian looks like chaos..." pp 251-252, and so in Minimal Requirements Bateson was
 * 1) Making an analysis of the foundations of scientific thought.

Another matter is that Bateson did not develop a mature definition of double bind. As he said in the Intro to Steps to an Ecology of Mind: "In the nature of the case, an explorer can never know what he is exploring until it has been explored" and "It was only in late 1969 that I became fully conscious of what I had been doing." p. xvi. And so his thinking can be understood only by a very slow and careful reading and rereading, jumping back and forth and connecting concepts. Also, he expected his listeners to do their own thinking, not simply look for answers. Speed reading Bateson is impossible.

I expect you want to know my scientific credentials. I was raised by 2 anthropologists (comparative linguistics and ethnology); due to their professional relationship we children grew up in a milieu of scientific discussion and were expected to understand and adhere to scientific methodology from earliest childhood. However, due to the intense doublebinding originating in my mother's family system I opted out of science as a profession--to do recovery. So I have an insider's understanding of double bind. (Bateson made instant sense to me).

Seeing the obstacles in making progress concerning defining DBT I have been corresponding with MC Bateson (his daughter) who has written and given talks on double bind. I let her know you had opened a page on Psychology Wiki.

Yet another problem is that many of the early articles either are no longer in print or are difficult to access. However, if you read Bale you will see why a better understanding of complex systems theory is urgently needed. Classical science defined situations with multiple variables as outside the purview of science. And so we have lost 30 years in delays in understanding ecosystems including the global system, and including human ecosystems such as cultures--and the economy--as well as DBT. (Note: the Wikipedia entry on complex systems theory includes the economy.) If you have any objections to what is written in the Wikipedia entry please let me know. Feedback is another key element of self-regulating,self-correcting, self-healing systems--Margaret9mary 02:30, 27 February 2009 (UTC)

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